Is rap music meant to be taken seriously?

[Pendraflare]

As you may know, rap music is a type of music where the singer talks lyrically instead of to a specific musical tone. We have quite a few well known rappers today, like Eminem, Jay-Z, Kanye West, Pitbull, Flo Rida, Lil Wayne, Drake, among others. But there are a lot of rap songs out there by some of these artists that focus on pretty raunchy subjects such as having sex with women, and the mention of their private parts. Some people are critical of certain rap lyrics for that reason. However, and I mentioned this in another thread in this forum, but I read in the comments of one of Pitbull's music videos that his music isn't something you're supposed to take seriously, and given the nature of his tracks I don't think I would (disagree), which is kind of why I see him as a guilty pleasure. In another thread, I also mentioned a certain song by a certain female rapper that is basically a 2010's take on Baby Got Back, and not that I care for that certain song but I feel like I can say the same thing about most of her stuff (that it's not serious).

Based on these things, do you think rap music is something just thrown out there to get controversial when they touch on matters like sex? Or is it made with the intent that listeners won't actually take its lyrical content seriously? Discuss.

 

[obZen]

I've listened to rap from the early 1970s to 2014 and on, so I've got a couple of things to say:

Rap was always meant to be a musical outlet for the black community.
Lightnin' Rod (1973) was rapping about gambling, smoking pot, beating people up, and getting girls during his teen years
See: Sport
He was one of the oldest rappers I'd ever heard do this
Ice-T rapped the first "gangster" album, and said that it was to portray a black, suburban youth's mentality. The whole idea of gangster was more of a mentality, and these guys wanted to show it
NWA was more about them being oppressed for being black, and showed their hatred for cops with some interesting songs

Though, this has (de)evolved into rapping about drugs and money, and how many girls one can wrangle
And forget the new millenium; someone like Pitbull is just a money maker. HE is not to be taken seriously. Some rappers still use hip-hop as an outlet, like Hopsin or even Kanye West believe it or not. A song like Through the Wire exemplifies just that

Musically, it started with this weird blend between talking (rapping?) poetry spoken to a funky, disco, and/or african drumb beat (Lightnin' Rod, the Last Poets)
Now, it's very electronic and inspired by R&B.

That's my take on rap

 

[Oryx]

I think rap, in the mainstream, is just like any other genre in the mainstream - a good chunk of them just make what sells, a smaller amount tries to please a certain demographic, and an even smaller amount tries to make good music.

 

[maccrash]

oh dear sweet christ. of course it's meant to be taken seriously. it's absolutely disgustingly ignorant to suggest otherwise.

there might be some artists in the genre that don't take it seriously but what you should keep in mind is that there are artists like that in every single genre ever. also, I don't think Pitbull, Flo Rida, Lil Wayne and Drake are exactly representative of rap at all. they're all (except Drake) accused of pretty much bastardizing the genre as a matter of fact.

here are some examples of rap that proves that it is obviously meant to be taken seriously:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=InFbBlpDTfQ
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5yR7VB9FpJI (check the lyrics)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dq3-nh6luOU
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0NUX4tW5pps
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HEwSfbE9IXc
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jfFTT3iz740
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C6CJQ_hnm24

I could go on and on and on and on. and maybe some of the lyrics in that are a bit "immature" (i.e. bluntly (no pun intended) talk about sex and drugs) but that does not in any way, shape, or form take away from the legitimacy of the genre as an art-form.

e: this might sound hostile; I apologize. I'm a bit passionate about things of this nature! (0:

 

[Aether★]

Tech N9ne, Nas, Redman, Method Man, Ice Cube, I could count many many other... Those are why I still take rap music seriously. They give me hope for the whole genre.

 

[Pendraflare]

while I'm certain that not all rappers rap about sex all the time at all, you've really only looked at the surface of that "certain female rapper"'s discography, because if you looked into it more, you'd be able to see, she writes a lot more meaningful stuff than people like to credit her for, simply because they base her off her ****** pop singles that most rap/urban artists end up releasing for chart exposure.

That's not true. I have heard more of Nicki Minaj than just Anaconda, including tracks like Starships, and some of the Roman Reloaded works (which admittedly I wasn't the biggest fan of). Now I wouldn't say Nicki Minaj isn't serious, but I tend to feel she can get suggestive which is why I don't take her super seriously often.

But my opinion is that rap, like most genres, has it's serious side and a fun side. I really don't understand why people would restrict their music to all serious and no fun or songs that can just be simply danced to and enjoyed, but thats just me and also for another thread.

There's the serious side, that I feel, say, Kanye West and Jay-Z gravitate more towards, where the fun side is what I think Pitbull, Flo Rida, Lil Wayne and Drake tend to be more of.

So yeah. Rap can be taken seriously. Loads of rap songs have a tonne of meaning, I can think of many many Eminem, Jay-Z and Nicki Minaj songs that are meaningful, whilst they still maintain a side to themselves that aren't meant to be taken seriously.

For Eminem, you have stuff like Cleaning Up My Closet, Lose Yourself, Not Afraid and even Guts Over Fear (his newest track) that do touch on matters that aren't too light, so I will agree with this much at least.

I think rap, in the mainstream, is just like any other genre in the mainstream - a good chunk of them just make what sells, a smaller amount tries to please a certain demographic, and an even smaller amount tries to make good music.

In this sense, you could say that the likes of the well-known rappers on today's mainstream, like Nicki Minaj, Drake and Pitbull, are the first of those three groups, but they're clearly doing something right even with their common criticism, otherwise they probably wouldn't sell. Kanye West and Eminem are the ones that do get serious and fit into the third "smaller" amount (but they also make what sells). As for the second I can't really determine, but the raunchier topics are likely intended for the more mature audiences.

oh dear sweet christ. of course it's meant to be taken seriously. it's absolutely disgustingly ignorant to suggest otherwise.

there might be some artists in the genre that don't take it seriously but what you should keep in mind is that there are artists like that in every single genre ever. also, I don't think Pitbull, Flo Rida, Lil Wayne and Drake are exactly representative of rap at all. they're all (except Drake) accused of pretty much bastardizing the genre as a matter of fact.

here are some examples of rap that proves that it is obviously meant to be taken seriously:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=InFbBlpDTfQ
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5yR7VB9FpJI (check the lyrics)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dq3-nh6luOU
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0NUX4tW5pps
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HEwSfbE9IXc
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jfFTT3iz740
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C6CJQ_hnm24

I could go on and on and on and on. and maybe some of the lyrics in that are a bit "immature" (i.e. bluntly (no pun intended) talk about sex and drugs) but that does not in any way, shape, or form take away from the legitimacy of the genre as an art-form.

e: this might sound hostile; I apologize. I'm a bit passionate about things of this nature! (0:

"Disgustingly ignorant"? I resent that, mind you. It may just be more the freestyle and not actual singing that rappers do which is why I don't exactly take some seriously. I'm not as passionate about this nature as you are, as you may or may not see. As I mentioned in reply to Oryx, we have Eminem and Kanye West that do talk bigger matters.

But obZen, although I didn't quote his post he did make a point that a lot of rappers talk about sex, money and drugs (which I did give a small mention of in the OP), most of which are just money makers and they're the ones not as technical.

 

[maccrash]

"Disgustingly ignorant"? I resent that, mind you. It may just be more the freestyle and not actual singing that rappers do which is why I don't exactly take some seriously. I'm not as passionate about this nature as you are, as you may or may not see. As I mentioned in reply to Oryx, we have Eminem and Kanye West that do talk bigger matters.

it's more or less the same thing as rhythmic poetry. still art! it doesn't have to be singing for it to still be art.

disgustingly ignorant was me being a bit melodramatic and I apologize for that.

anyway, there are artists in every genre that are just having a bit of fun and aren't intending to make Serious And Significant Art or anything; you could make this same nitpick for rock (or any subset thereof), jazz, metal, pop, anything, but there will always be artists that take it very seriously and make, well, Serious And Significant Art. I hope this kinda clears things up. I didn't mean to be offensive!

 

[champagnepapi]

Here is a comment from an AMA on reddit by critically acclaimed rapper young thug before he was really deep in the industry. His music falls under the genre of trap rap so he often raps about "raunchy" things like the OP discusses.

I make a product for a certain audience and I'm good at it. Supply and demand, simple economics. I don't do this because I love the attention, I do this because I have a certain skill set that now allows me to get paid without the threat of doing federal time.

I think most of the time when an outsider to the genre talks about "rap=crap", a hiphophead will shove illmatic or my beautiful dark twisted fantasy in their face, however this doesnt exactly adress where the outsider's concerns lie. Most peoples negative perception of hiphop is due to the fact that theyve mainly been exposed to radio rap/trap rap which appears ignorant on the surface. As young thug puts it, this type of rap is basically him getting paid to have fun lyrically, and market it to people who want fun in their music as well (and the demand is heavy, most songs on pop radio are "fun" or party music. Even so, I think that the trap genre has artistic value. Rappers like young thug not only have carefree lyrics but are pushing the boundaries of rap sonically; young thug has an entirely unique flow and is backed by great production.

 

[Rogue planet]

Rock music was raised on a diet of sex and drugs.

Rap music was raised on the voice of inequality.

Now there's some rock n roll mixed in with rap, that's what sells. It's not exclusive to rap, it's how most of the top 100 is...

 

[El Héroe Oscuro]

Depends on the artist. Eminem actually makes solid music and has a lot of strong, deep thoughts behind his songs - only one of the reasons why I honestly believe he is the greatest rapper of our generation. On the other spectrum, if you compare him to say Nicki Minaj, well...you can sort of see where I'm going with this right?

 

[donavannj]

You have to dive beyond the surface and shed your misconceptions of the genres of rap and hip-hop in order to really find meaningful rap music (you also have to actually be able to understand what they're saying in the lyrics, too, and that's something I know many people do struggle with when it comes to the faster rappers in the genre). Rap really doesn't deserve anymore scrutiny than any other genre, as most of the top 50 songs of most genres are about any combination of the following 4 things: sex, money, love, drugs, and many others that aren't are just about dancing, which itself is also a "shallow" subject.

I will point you to Kriss Kross's song, It's a Shame:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=23M0Cj6rOs4

It basically is about how gang violence is tearing up the streets of the "hood" and how the turf wars of the young men of the time were setting a terrible example for their younger family and neighbors, and it's also partly a plea to stop the violence. There is plenty of other meaningful rap like this, you just have to delve deeper and past the biggest names (and many of the biggest names do have meaningful rap, such as Eminem's When I'm Gone, which is personal and emotional, or Chamillionaire's Hip-Hop Police/Evening News, which is political and focuses on a considerable number of things, including parodying the hyper-sensationalism of 24/7 cable news media). It's not any less meaningful as a genre as the various forms of rock, and I'd argue that it's got considerably deeper meaning than some specific subgenres of metal.

 

[Bounsweet]

A good deal of Eminem's early stuff was pretty serious, some of his current stuff is too, but that's as far as I go when listening to rappers with the intent of finding some "serious" songs.

I don't listen to much music, period, so I can't differentiate between hip-hop and rap, so I don't know if this counts as which, but Nujabes is another artist who I really love. RIP :( I've also been listening to Mr. J. Medeiros' song "Her Wings" which I really enjoy.

So, I guess what I'm saying is that rap/hip-hop can indeed be taken very seriously.

 

[«Chuckles»]

Well there's definetely groups out there that are trying to get a message across hell look at the 80's we had Public Enemy, NWA etc. and they were all rapping about the oppression they face Public Enemy is still rapping about the oppression. People like Wu-Tang rap about a more singular level about being a better person.

Aussi hip hop here should be taken seriously as they have some stuff to say about the way our Government treats us and stuff.

Honestly if you try to take it seriously and it has something you can take away from it positively then sure take it serious

 

[Frequency]

Yo, shoutout's to the Nujabes reference. I'm glad I'm not the only one.

Moving on, I don't know. I believe that it is meant to be taken seriously when you aren't listening to purely the club bangers that artists like the entire Young Money crew seem to drop (despite Wayne and Drake having their 1 in 1000 non club bangers, Drake gets a pass on this because some of his songs are more like this than others), but the problem is that club bangers are what the masses care about. But then we can look at a lot of the artists who have been mentioned above, and clearly tell it isn't just about *insert raunchy subject here* and you can clearly take the words seriously because they have meaning. I mean, look at Hopsin.

It can be a matter of perspective. I mean, some people take the "money clothes wimenz" songs just as seriously sometimes because they aspire to be just like the rappers who keep spouting the same garbage every album, every mixtape, and every LP that drops from the same different artists they love so much.

 

[VeranithasVI]

Well, of course it's meant to be taken seriously. It's a form of art, and as far as I'm aware all artists want their work too be taken seriously. Even Nicki Minaj with her horrendous rendition of Baby Got Back, I'm sure she wanted that to be taken seriously.

I'm not the biggest fan of rap myself, but just because something doesn't necessarily appeal too somebody doesn't mean it shouldn't be or isn't meant to be taken seriously.

 

[TheDeadEvilDead]

I'm not a massive fan of rap, I don't think anything bad of it and enjoy it when I listen to it- I just never choose to listen to it

From what I've heard there's loads of crap out there, just simple garbage, there's also a lot with a lot with deep, meaningful lyrics that actually hold a serious message and others that aren't really serious but aren't half bad (just like every other genre really), then there are the funny youtube rappers which obviously aren't serious

I would give some examples but my friends know what rap I like and don't like better than I do

 

[Pendraflare]

Here is a comment from an AMA on reddit by critically acclaimed rapper young thug before he was really deep in the industry. His music falls under the genre of trap rap so he often raps about "raunchy" things like the OP discusses.



I think most of the time when an outsider to the genre talks about "rap=crap", a hiphophead will shove illmatic or my beautiful dark twisted fantasy in their face, however this doesnt exactly adress where the outsider's concerns lie. Most peoples negative perception of hiphop is due to the fact that theyve mainly been exposed to radio rap/trap rap which appears ignorant on the surface. As young thug puts it, this type of rap is basically him getting paid to have fun lyrically, and market it to people who want fun in their music as well (and the demand is heavy, most songs on pop radio are "fun" or party music. Even so, I think that the trap genre has artistic value. Rappers like young thug not only have carefree lyrics but are pushing the boundaries of rap sonically; young thug has an entirely unique flow and is backed by great production.

This kinda sums up what I have to say about some of the more "infamous" and less serious ones who are mostly about partying, drinks and what not.

For that matter, some people may not mind that kind of track. Like Lil Jon, for example - although his music is basically just crazy club stuff (and I won't argue that the likes of Flo Rida, Lil Wayne and Pitbull aren't much different), he's enjoyed for his loud and crazy nature. At least that's what the Rap Critic sees him as, anyway.

 

[Weeaboo Name]

I like all music except rap and country. xD

 

[Cosmo's Factory]

Disclaimer: not a rap guy.
That being said, there are some absolute geniuses out there making their names in rap music and it's really cruel to say the medium isn't supposed to be taken seriously just because of pop music. Rap isn't a genre, it's a medium. It's a method to express yourself. It's container for an idea. Although the container has an influence on the idea, it's largely cosmetic and minimal. Coffee is coffee, whether you drink it from a coffee mug or a styrofoam cup or a tea cup. So when people say "Well rap isn't supposed to be taken seriously", it sounds to me like they're saying "Nothing in a styrofoam cup tastes good". It just sounds weird and you don't gain anything from saying that. You just miss out on some good music.

 

[kuzronk]

It depends on the artist/song. Their is a diffence between Public Enemy and Chingy (that 00s nelly rip-off) for example.